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PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 8:22 pm 
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Location: Soham, Cambridgeshire
I really should stop skimming through posts and read them thoroughly. :oops: I was gonna try it without the centre bearing. I got the powerflex bushes and they look identical in design to the flo-flex/deflex ones.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 9:27 pm 
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Location: shropshire
right then, ive been busy

going to find out once and for all if the little plastic bush / bearing is no longer needed with flo-flex

started with simply offering it up

Image

as you can see the inner step is the right size and concentric to the inner mount hole


taking a closer look at the bushes as they would be assembled, and given that the overall thickness of the bush assembly will be dictated by the steel spacer within, it can be seen that both inner steps meet together to form what would appear to be an inner ploy bush instead of using the plastic bearing

Image

the outer chamfered lip is not only there to exert extra force to the mounting as it is compressed to give les deflection with movement to firm up the ride, but the fact that the edges are chamfered bodes well to this theory since it offers point contact to the edge circumference to allow for some movement of the whole assembly relative to the mount and to prevent the whole bush being squashed and displaced sideways (looking down its centre hole) under extreme deflection since the bush just slightly splays out beyond the support washer at the edge effectively gripping the bush to the washer, plus if it was totally flat the bushes would be under stress at anything other than resting position, this would go some way to explain why the factory setup uses the inner bearing so that its not a flat surface to a flat surface,
for example, the inner track arm pivots bushes are fitted flat surface to flat surface since you do not want them to twist along the centre line of the securing bolt, this is the last thing you want here, but you do need a certain amount of twisting relative to the tie rod centre line to the mounting bracket that bolts to the car, so you don't want a flat surface either side, see?

so I measured the depth of the step

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Image

X2

compared to the inner bush of the standard setup

Image

X1

giving roughly 1mm extra to compress the 2 inner steps together to ensure they stay compressed together

then I measured the O.D. of the original bush

Image

and compared it to the O.D. of the flo-flex step

Image

and taking into account that a vernier calliper is not ideal for accurately measuring a soft material, this is as near as in needed for this purpose.

so satisfying myself that they are intended without the inner plastic bush I assembled them together

Image
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and they look and feel spot on, I lubricated them with silicone and just tightened the nut enough to slightly compress the bushes then manipulated them to be concentric to the tie bar mounting, the inner steps engaged with a positive "snap" then I tightened the nut to full tightness and the assembly is firm without any risk of stepping out of concentricity with the mounting hole.

therefore I am confident enough to say that you do not use the inner bearing with the flo-flex bushes, if this was intended then the inner step of the flo-flex bushes would not be there since a protrusion such as this will certainly displace the small plastic tabs on the one side of the bearing.

while on the subject of this, what was the fuss about with the tie rod nuts?
after reading on here that they were a special fine thread of 14x1mm I tried looking for some to no avail, so I spent a good hour today making some on my lathe to that thread pitch only to find they did not fit? (ok so I know I should have checked first) so just nipped down the road and got a bag of 14x1.5mm nylocs for a few quid? job done


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 9:52 pm 
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Location: rotherham,south yorkshire
cheers for puting in the hard work mate paid dividence :)

and helped me to know whta shwta when i coem to re asemble :)

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 9:58 pm 
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Location: birmingham
i blame jason,sure it was him that said it was pointless fitting poly tie bar bush's unless the plasic thing was mint,tut tut,

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 12:23 am 
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Location: County Durham.
:eh:
Don't blame me!

LOL!

Jason.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 1:09 am 
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Location: peth,scotland
the step on the floflex bush does away with the plastic insert, you dont need it, i dont use one

you do need it with a standard flat foamy rubber bush tho


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 9:10 am 
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Nice research. I had a mare getting these right on my car and was starting to get the arse with them. Guess mine is built wrong howeverf they have lasted the year! Il get another new set and try again! Did you look to find my thread and see the washers i made? IO did them because when i tightened the assembly together it squashed the bushes terrible. So the washers i did held the bush and stopped this! Good job i kept all the original parts to!!

Cheers for explaining all this tho!!

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 11:18 pm 
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Location: County Durham.
So, why the F*ck don't Deflex/Flowflex include fitting instructions with their bushes?

Jason.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2010 11:18 am 
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Joined: Mon Jul 19, 2010 9:23 am
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Location: shropshire
that is a very good question

especially since the parts are safety critical

they should either make like for like so replacement is straight forward (which is what I thought I was getting) or comprehensive instructions

I bet there's a few fiestas knocking about with the plastic bearing installed, not to mention all the other cars that they do bushes for.


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 06, 2010 6:39 am 
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Well i got got confused on the rears as one bushes is wider than the other and i didnt know which way to put them. Again what ever i have done has lasted the year but i will have to go through it all and sort it out! The lack of instructions is a real pain! I spoke to a flo flex rep at a show and asked if they were ever going to do the rear shock top bushes and he said no and that was it. Not have you got the rest, how did you get on with the rest of the kit!

Perhaps a full fitting guide and explaination is required on here when we are sure we have one car that is right!

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 06, 2010 7:02 am 
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Joined: Mon Jul 19, 2010 9:23 am
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Location: shropshire
Danthefestaman wrote:

Perhaps a full fitting guide and explaination is required on here when we are sure we have one car that is right!


thats a good idea, stick it in FAQ
ive allready got the pics of the tie bar end bushes and i will be doing the rears soon, prehaps if we all stick our heads together we will get it sussed in the end 8)


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 06, 2010 12:08 pm 
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Joined: Fri May 23, 2003 11:04 pm
Posts: 22291
Location: County Durham.
jin wrote:
......I bet there's a few fiestas knocking about with the plastic bearing installed, not to mention all the other cars that they do bushes for.


Yup!
Our 1.1 for starters!!

As for a guide.
I have a partialy complete one.
It's on my list of 'things to do'. :lol:

Obviously, it needs 'tweeking' though.

Jason.


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